Hi, here some testing results concerning mkgmap routing on the new Garmin devices (etrex 20/30), firmware 2.4, default style. available vehicles : motorcar / bicycle / pedestrian available avoid-options: Toll-roads / unpaved roads / carpool-lanes / u-turns / motorways as already observed in BaseCamp, access flags (motorcar=no, access=no, etc.) don't seem to work anymore. Still working: oneway (all transport modes, even pedestrian) turn restrictions (all transport modes, even pedestrian) All avoid-options seem to work (didn't test toll-roads). Also I can't see a big difference in short routes vs. fast routes. Note that some people reported different results with other (non-default) mkgmap-maps. Conclusion: with some tricks (use avoid-flags) one can build working routable-maps for the new devices, until the NT format is decoded. Chris
Am 16.11.2011 18:33, schrieb Chris66:
here some testing results concerning mkgmap routing on the new Garmin devices (etrex 20/30), firmware 2.4, default style. All avoid-options seem to work (didn't test toll-roads).
Yes, the 'toll'-flag works but I think 'mkgmap:carpool' flag is not working. Also interesting: The 'destination' flag works: access=destination and motorcar=destination blocks the road for motorcars (not bicycle/pedestrians).
Also I can't see a big difference in short routes vs. fast routes.
Maybe this was because I used the merge-line option or ignore-maxspeeds. Chris
Am 17.11.2011 19:17, schrieb Chris66:
but I think 'mkgmap:carpool' flag is not working.
More testing with this flag on my etrex 20: it don't works if set alone (without other access flags). what works: mkgmap:carpool=1 + access=no blocks motorcars and bicycles from this road if 'avoid-carpool' is set. (No blocking for pedestrians). note that mkgmap:carpool=1 + access=no + bicycle=yes is not working (blocking bicycles, ignoring the bicycle flag). Chris
Interesting tests Chris. I wonder how this works out on Basecamp? I've noticed that using 'avoid carpool' the routing gets very unpredictable, but maybe because I don't use it in my styles. To use a gmapsupp.img in Basecamp, you can reset the MS flag in the gmapsupp header from 1 to zero and connect the GPS (or use a card reader) to your computer. How to reset the MS flag: use IMGmod from http://www.javawa.nl/gpskaart.html , GMaptool or with the gmt command gmt.exe -w -c .,0 gmapsupp.img See also http://www.mail-archive.com/mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk/msg10457.html
Am 18.11.2011 13:04, schrieb Minko:
Interesting tests Chris. I wonder how this works out on Basecamp? I've noticed that using 'avoid carpool' the routing gets very unpredictable, but maybe because I don't use it in my styles.
In BaseCamp (v3.2.2) it's more or less the same: motorcar/foot/bicycle=no : not working motorcar=destination : WORKING (so a good replacement for motorcar=no) avoid toll and avoid unpaved : working mkgmap:carpool=1 + access=no : blocking car and bike one difference I found: oneway=yes is also restricting pedestrians on my eTrex20 BUT NOT IN BASECAMP ! My Test-Map: <up.picr.de/8804526wxq.png> ;-) The right-side part is for testing the "avoid sharp turns" feature in the Garmin routing algorithm. As you see it's still present. Chris
In Basecamp, I tested the routing on one highway=unclassified and added extra tags in my style file. Here are some test results: highway=unclassified { set motorcar=no; set motorcycle=no } or { set motorcar=no } or { set motorcycle=no } or { set access=no } - carpool avoidance NOT selected: Road routable for cars, bicycle, motorcycle, foot + carpool avoidance selected: Road NOT routable for cars, bicycle, motorcycle; routable for foot { set mkgmap:carpool=1 } or { set motorcar=no; set mkgmap:carpool=1 } - carpool avoidance NOT selected: Road not routable for cars! Road routable for bicycle, motorcycle, foot + carpool avoidance selected: Road not routable for cars, bicycle, motorcycle; routable for foot {set motorcar=destination } / {set motorcycle=destination } / {set access=destination } Both options are routable for all vehicles EXCEPT cars (not routable); same behaviour as in Mapsource NB motorcycle = destination doesnt block motorcycles! { set access=no; set motorcar=yes } both carpool options are routable for all vehicles { set bicycle=no } both options are routable for all vehicles {set bicycle=destination } both options are routable for all vehicles { set carpool=yes } both options are routable for all vehicles {set motor_vehicle=destination } both options are routable for all vehicles Conclusion - some access tags only work for all vehicles if carpool avoidance is used - mkgmap:carpool=1 can block the road for cars only - motorcar=destination/acces=destination can block the road for cars, for other vehicles carpool option must be used. Question: are those observations caused by parameters in the routing that is hardcoded by mkgmap?
Your testing rubbish, sorry to say so. mkgmap:carpool is more or less equal to access=no; it should actually never be implemented in a map, as it mainly causes trouble, there is not proper use for it. destination and no should be handled equally by mkgmap, Garmin only knows no or yes. So if destination blocks something for you that mkgmap doesn't, recheck for errors with gpsmapedit what actually happened. Cause if destination is handled like no by mkgmap (which would be the correct way, cause garmin handles no like destination is defined by osm, while no doesn't exist ( only insofar as making a road not routable at all) differently, either you or mkgmap do something wrong. On 21.11.2011 19:30, Minko wrote:
In Basecamp, I tested the routing on one highway=unclassified and added extra tags in my style file. Here are some test results:
highway=unclassified { set motorcar=no; set motorcycle=no } or { set motorcar=no } or { set motorcycle=no } or { set access=no }
- carpool avoidance NOT selected: Road routable for cars, bicycle, motorcycle, foot
+ carpool avoidance selected: Road NOT routable for cars, bicycle, motorcycle; routable for foot
{ set mkgmap:carpool=1 } or { set motorcar=no; set mkgmap:carpool=1 }
- carpool avoidance NOT selected: Road not routable for cars! Road routable for bicycle, motorcycle, foot
+ carpool avoidance selected: Road not routable for cars, bicycle, motorcycle; routable for foot
{set motorcar=destination } / {set motorcycle=destination } / {set access=destination } Both options are routable for all vehicles EXCEPT cars (not routable); same behaviour as in Mapsource NB motorcycle = destination doesnt block motorcycles!
{ set access=no; set motorcar=yes } both carpool options are routable for all vehicles { set bicycle=no } both options are routable for all vehicles {set bicycle=destination } both options are routable for all vehicles { set carpool=yes } both options are routable for all vehicles {set motor_vehicle=destination } both options are routable for all vehicles
Conclusion
- some access tags only work for all vehicles if carpool avoidance is used - mkgmap:carpool=1 can block the road for cars only - motorcar=destination/acces=destination can block the road for cars, for other vehicles carpool option must be used.
Question: are those observations caused by parameters in the routing that is hardcoded by mkgmap? _______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
Just check up the the list on carpool. There is an old post by Mark that explains what it does. But go ahead with the carpool stuff if you like to. I don't think carpool is useful at all and you can achieve the same things otherwise. Moreover I take you destination difference 100% attributed to the carpool rubbish. On 21.11.2011 19:54, Minko wrote:
Check it your self Felix, I'm not talking non sense. Chris confirmed this too.
Actually see here what carpool means from the person who implemented it ( it is therefore in reality no avoidance, but just an combined setting of no on several vehicles): /That's because the "carpoolness" of a way is specified by having all of the access bits except for CARPOOL, EMERGENCY (and, optionally, BUS) disabled. That's how it becomes a carpool way./ http://www.mail-archive.com/mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk/msg04198.html On 21.11.2011 19:54, Minko wrote:
Check it your self Felix, I'm not talking non sense. Chris confirmed this too.
I use carpool lanes to avoid cars from cycleways - and it works fine. highway = radweg {add mkgmap:carpool=1} highway = radweg {add access = no; add bicycle = yes; add foot = yes} Regards Klaus -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/routing-on-new-devices-tp7001203p7019728.htm... Sent from the Mkgmap Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Am 22.11.2011 09:30, schrieb toc-rox:
highway = radweg
Wie wär's mit 'highway=cycleway', oder fällt dies auch unter die Kategorie 'jeder kann amchen, was er will.' -- PGP Schlüssel: 311D1055 http://keyserver.pgp.com
The code snippet was incomplete: highway = cycleway & bicycle = designated {set highway = radweg} highway = path & bicycle = designated {set highway = radweg} highway = path & bicycle = official {set highway = radweg} # "radweg" verarbeiten: # --------------------- # Verbleibende Elemente "highway = cycleway" umdefinieren: highway = cycleway {set highway = radweg} # Standardwerte hinzufügen (nur Fußgänger und Radfahrer zulassen) highway = radweg {add mkgmap:carpool=1} highway = radweg {add access = no; add bicycle = yes; add foot = yes} # Routing # 0x10 = Bitmap 2 (breit) highway = radweg [0x10 road_class=0 road_speed=1 resolution 24 continue] -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/routing-on-new-devices-tp7001203p7020705.htm... Sent from the Mkgmap Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
On 22.11.2011 16:03, toc-rox wrote:
The code snippet was incomplete:
highway = cycleway& bicycle = designated {set highway = radweg} highway = path& bicycle = designated {set highway = radweg} highway = path& bicycle = official {set highway = radweg}
# "radweg" verarbeiten: # ---------------------
# Verbleibende Elemente "highway = cycleway" umdefinieren: highway = cycleway {set highway = radweg}
# Standardwerte hinzufügen (nur Fußgänger und Radfahrer zulassen) highway = radweg {add mkgmap:carpool=1} highway = radweg {add access = no; add bicycle = yes; add foot = yes} well and here is a contradiction actually. adding biycle=yes and foot=yes does not change anything, cause they are added as bicycle=no and foot=no by mkgmap:carpool=1 beforehand. So effectively you block cyclists and pedestrians too (check it up in gpsmapedit). If on the other hand you used set bicycle=yes then you would crash the mkgmap:carpool=1 that you set/added beforehand. Anyhow for trying out stuff add action is not suitable at all and you should use set action.
# Routing # 0x10 = Bitmap 2 (breit) highway = radweg [0x10 road_class=0 road_speed=1 resolution 24 continue]
-- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/routing-on-new-devices-tp7001203p7020705.htm... Sent from the Mkgmap Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com. _______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
The idea behind "avoid carpool lanes" is: - different profiles for cars, bicycles (and pedestrians) - car profile: avoid carpool lanes - bicycle profile: allow carpool lanes Regards Klaus PS: Concerning "add" and "set" - I agree - "set" would be better. -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/routing-on-new-devices-tp7001203p7020850.htm... Sent from the Mkgmap Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Chris, As I mentioned here before, I noticed that with the map I downloaded from garmin.openstreetmap.nl that the new eTrex 30 always acts as if I had selected "pedestrian" even when I select "motorcar". Regards, Frank 2011/11/16 Chris66 <chris66nrw@gmx.de>:
Hi, here some testing results concerning mkgmap routing on the new Garmin devices (etrex 20/30), firmware 2.4, default style.
available vehicles : motorcar / bicycle / pedestrian
available avoid-options: Toll-roads / unpaved roads / carpool-lanes / u-turns / motorways
as already observed in BaseCamp, access flags (motorcar=no, access=no, etc.) don't seem to work anymore.
Still working: oneway (all transport modes, even pedestrian) turn restrictions (all transport modes, even pedestrian)
All avoid-options seem to work (didn't test toll-roads).
Also I can't see a big difference in short routes vs. fast routes.
Note that some people reported different results with other (non-default) mkgmap-maps.
Conclusion: with some tricks (use avoid-flags) one can build working routable-maps for the new devices, until the NT format is decoded.
Chris
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participants (6)
-
Chris66 -
Felix Hartmann -
Frank Fesevur -
Josef Latt -
Minko -
toc-rox