Re: [mkgmap-dev] Garmin Topo Europe map
Hi. I made a few tests to lower the size of the maps. Comparison is made to my standard map which is based on the styles example in mkgmap but extended a bit for my purposes. This has 100 % size. There are 4 levels, 24 is the most detailed resolution. Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 78 %. Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 64 %. Using my minimal style (discussed earlier in this thread). Compared to normal map, it is about 75 % in size. Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 63 %. Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 51 %. I noted that when resolution is set to 23 polygons smaller than the mentioned raster at ~4.8 m disappear. They also do get distorted. Buildings are such polygons that are effected a lot, and it is (in my opinion) a good idea to disable buildings and similar polygons entirely when lowering the resolution. Coast lines and alike become less detailed of course. Some line segments have become a bit misaligned (i noted bus stop platforms and similar short lines can have this issue). I yet have to check how well these maps work on a unit but it seems possible to lower the size quite a lot if it is desired. Regards Karl On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 13:27:06 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi,
am also working on a "lite" style and there may be some nice idea in yours to use :) will check that out, thanks!
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.30. 12:08, 7770 wrote:
Hi. I am ok with sharing the style, but i was not able to do it until today (planned today or tomorrow). 5 files attached, 4 related to style, 1 to TYP (foskan.txt). Only those 4 style files have changes, compared to the standard.
The complete set of files is ./mkgmap-rNNNN/examples/styles/default/
There is nothing fancy nor complex, nor have i played around with the levels yet.
For reference i also added my TYP-file, which may help in case you find some type codes which are non standard (there might be a few). The type file is shared and does contain a few things that are not used by the minimal style (don't get confused).
Summery of the style, which is based on the default mkgmap example. All changes comments are marked with ## to be able to tell them apart from regular comments given after #.
polygons and points do have a lot of disabled information. Buildings, shops, and most of the parking types are disables.
lines doesn't have as many changes and probably a few more small waterways (streams, rapids, waterfalls) can be disabled to remove yet a bit of data.
note for polygons. Waters and forests are still visible, since it adds information to the map, but if natural objects are not important for you, there is more space to save.
i have made one change in lines file to display the road name on tertiary roads instead of the reference. this does make sense in nordic countries, where tertiary roads are usually only referred to with the name.
Ski lifts (arealways in general) are set in similar way as railroads.
One last thing to mention is that i have updated the inc/address file. Close to the end there is a section in which the mkgmap:phone is updated to show information about which fuels are sold at fuel stations. This is not fully complete for all fuel types but the ones i somehow considered important. Depending on where one is, a few more fuel types can easily be added.
A note. The mkgmap:phone seems to be 50 characters maximum, longer data will be truncated and not shown on the device it seems.
Regards and happy new year! Karl
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 10:16:51 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi Karl,
don't you want to share your minimal style? :)
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.27. 20:59, 7770 wrote:
Hi. A few observations about the TopoActive europe map. (i have it on a GPSMAP 66st).
The map is rendered slower than most custom made maps. Updates occur 2 times per year, but even at those times many changes to OSM are not present. Perhaps they only update some parts yearly. Points lack all kind of additional information which other mappers add (opening hours, region, phone numbers, etc.). One nice thing is colour marked national parks and reserves. Being an outdoor map, it lacks some information about shelters in the wilderness. Routing is possible only for outdoor activities (cycle, walk, hike, direct), automotive routing (car, motorcycle) is disabled.
I have tried creating a minimal style. This lowers the data to about 75 % or my normal set up. But i did not change the level, which i will try :-) Currently I am no way near the compression which TopoActive achieves. Using input data which is about 6,7 GB in pbf format, creates a gmapsupp just below 4 GB for normal and around 3 GB for minimal style. These numbers feels similar to getting France into 1.9 GB from 3.7 GB pbf (geofabrik).
The minimal set up is not very fancy at all, it disables things not wanted. Buildings, shops, most of parkings, and a bit more.
Today i cannot send off any style, but in case that would be of interest let me know and i can share it in a few days (guessing Wednesday or Thursday).
Regards Karl
On söndag 27 december 2020 kl. 20:08:10 CET Gerd Petermann wrote:
Hi Pierre,
my first guess would be that the level 0 is at resolution 23 instead of 24.
Gerd
________________________________________ Von: mkgmap-dev <mkgmap-dev-bounces@lists.mkgmap.org.uk> im Auftrag von Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Dezember 2020 19:37 An: Development list for mkgmap Betreff: [mkgmap-dev] Garmin Topo Europe map
Hello guys,
I've just discovered the Garmin TopoActive Europe map based on OpenStreetMap data. This map is sold at a price of 50€ or is pre-installed on some new devices. I've just seen it on the device of one of my friends and it looks very good. I'm surprised to see that for West Europe, it takes only 2.8GB and is quite complete (index for search, routable, ...).
For now, I generate my own maps based on your excellent tool but the result is much bigger (1.9GB only for France with probably more details). So, my question is: does anybody have a similar configuration (style files and command line) to obtain a result like the Garmin TopoActive Europe ?
Thanks, Pierre _______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
Hi Karl, Thanks for your analysis, very instructive. I've tried several of your steps and arrived at the conclusion that it's not a good idea to set the resolution to 23. Here are the 2 main reasons: 1. as you mentioned the map becomes less accurate, some roundabouts are converted into triangles, some line segments are misaligned ... 2. from the cgpsmapper guide: "IMG file should be created with Level 0 equal to 24 – otherwise distance calculation might be wrong" Do you know if the Garmin TopoActive map uses resolution 23 or 24 ? Pierre On Sun, Jan 3, 2021 at 8:21 AM 7770 <7770@foskan.eu> wrote:
Hi. I made a few tests to lower the size of the maps.
Comparison is made to my standard map which is based on the styles example in mkgmap but extended a bit for my purposes. This has 100 % size. There are 4 levels, 24 is the most detailed resolution.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 78 %.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 64 %.
Using my minimal style (discussed earlier in this thread). Compared to normal map, it is about 75 % in size.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 63 %.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 51 %.
I noted that when resolution is set to 23 polygons smaller than the mentioned raster at ~4.8 m disappear. They also do get distorted. Buildings are such polygons that are effected a lot, and it is (in my opinion) a good idea to disable buildings and similar polygons entirely when lowering the resolution. Coast lines and alike become less detailed of course. Some line segments have become a bit misaligned (i noted bus stop platforms and similar short lines can have this issue).
I yet have to check how well these maps work on a unit but it seems possible to lower the size quite a lot if it is desired.
Regards Karl
Hi,
am also working on a "lite" style and there may be some nice idea in yours to use :) will check that out, thanks!
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.30. 12:08, 7770 wrote:
Hi. I am ok with sharing the style, but i was not able to do it until today (planned today or tomorrow). 5 files attached, 4 related to style, 1 to TYP (foskan.txt). Only those 4 style files have changes, compared to the standard.
The complete set of files is ./mkgmap-rNNNN/examples/styles/default/
There is nothing fancy nor complex, nor have i played around with the levels yet.
For reference i also added my TYP-file, which may help in case you find some type codes which are non standard (there might be a few). The type file is shared and does contain a few things that are not used by the minimal style (don't get confused).
Summery of the style, which is based on the default mkgmap example. All changes comments are marked with ## to be able to tell them apart from regular comments given after #.
polygons and points do have a lot of disabled information. Buildings, shops, and most of the parking types are disables.
lines doesn't have as many changes and probably a few more small waterways (streams, rapids, waterfalls) can be disabled to remove yet a bit of data.
note for polygons. Waters and forests are still visible, since it adds information to the map, but if natural objects are not important for you, there is more space to save.
i have made one change in lines file to display the road name on tertiary roads instead of the reference. this does make sense in nordic countries, where tertiary roads are usually only referred to with the name.
Ski lifts (arealways in general) are set in similar way as railroads.
One last thing to mention is that i have updated the inc/address file. Close to the end there is a section in which the mkgmap:phone is updated to show information about which fuels are sold at fuel stations. This is not fully complete for all fuel types but the ones i somehow considered important. Depending on where one is, a few more fuel types can easily be added.
A note. The mkgmap:phone seems to be 50 characters maximum, longer data will be truncated and not shown on the device it seems.
Regards and happy new year! Karl
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 10:16:51 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi Karl,
don't you want to share your minimal style? :)
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.27. 20:59, 7770 wrote:
Hi. A few observations about the TopoActive europe map. (i have it on a GPSMAP 66st).
The map is rendered slower than most custom made maps. Updates occur 2 times per year, but even at those times many changes to OSM are not present. Perhaps they only update some parts yearly. Points lack all kind of additional information which other mappers add (opening hours, region, phone numbers, etc.). One nice thing is colour marked national parks and reserves. Being an outdoor map, it lacks some information about shelters in the wilderness. Routing is possible only for outdoor activities (cycle, walk, hike, direct), automotive routing (car, motorcycle) is disabled.
I have tried creating a minimal style. This lowers the data to about 75 % or my normal set up. But i did not change the level, which i will try :-) Currently I am no way near the compression which TopoActive achieves. Using input data which is about 6,7 GB in pbf format, creates a gmapsupp just below 4 GB for normal and around 3 GB for minimal style. These numbers feels similar to getting France into 1.9 GB from 3.7 GB pbf (geofabrik).
The minimal set up is not very fancy at all, it disables things not wanted. Buildings, shops, most of parkings, and a bit more.
Today i cannot send off any style, but in case that would be of interest let me know and i can share it in a few days (guessing Wednesday or Thursday).
Regards Karl
On söndag 27 december 2020 kl. 20:08:10 CET Gerd Petermann wrote:
Hi Pierre,
my first guess would be that the level 0 is at resolution 23 instead of
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 13:27:06 CET Vuki wrote: 24.
Gerd
________________________________________ Von: mkgmap-dev <mkgmap-dev-bounces@lists.mkgmap.org.uk> im Auftrag von Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Dezember
2020
19:37 An: Development list for mkgmap Betreff: [mkgmap-dev] Garmin Topo Europe map
Hello guys,
I've just discovered the Garmin TopoActive Europe map based on OpenStreetMap data. This map is sold at a price of 50€ or is pre-installed on some new devices. I've just seen it on the device of one of my friends and it looks very good. I'm surprised to see that for West Europe, it takes only 2.8GB and is quite complete (index for search, routable, ...).
For now, I generate my own maps based on your excellent tool but the result is much bigger (1.9GB only for France with probably more details). So, my question is: does anybody have a similar configuration (style files and command line) to obtain a result like the Garmin TopoActive Europe ?
Thanks, Pierre _______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
Garmin city navigator maps use 23. Else a Europe map within 4GB is out of question. However they use NT format too, which is about 1/3 smaller additionally. Same I guess for their Topo Europe maps. On Mon, 4 Jan 2021, 01:03 Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Karl,
Thanks for your analysis, very instructive. I've tried several of your steps and arrived at the conclusion that it's not a good idea to set the resolution to 23. Here are the 2 main reasons: 1. as you mentioned the map becomes less accurate, some roundabouts are converted into triangles, some line segments are misaligned ... 2. from the cgpsmapper guide: "IMG file should be created with Level 0 equal to 24 – otherwise distance calculation might be wrong"
Do you know if the Garmin TopoActive map uses resolution 23 or 24 ?
Pierre
On Sun, Jan 3, 2021 at 8:21 AM 7770 <7770@foskan.eu> wrote:
Hi. I made a few tests to lower the size of the maps.
Comparison is made to my standard map which is based on the styles example in mkgmap but extended a bit for my purposes. This has 100 % size. There are 4 levels, 24 is the most detailed resolution.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 78 %.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 64 %.
Using my minimal style (discussed earlier in this thread). Compared to normal map, it is about 75 % in size.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 63 %.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 51 %.
I noted that when resolution is set to 23 polygons smaller than the mentioned raster at ~4.8 m disappear. They also do get distorted. Buildings are such polygons that are effected a lot, and it is (in my opinion) a good idea to disable buildings and similar polygons entirely when lowering the resolution. Coast lines and alike become less detailed of course. Some line segments have become a bit misaligned (i noted bus stop platforms and similar short lines can have this issue).
I yet have to check how well these maps work on a unit but it seems possible to lower the size quite a lot if it is desired.
Regards Karl
Hi,
am also working on a "lite" style and there may be some nice idea in yours to use :) will check that out, thanks!
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.30. 12:08, 7770 wrote:
Hi. I am ok with sharing the style, but i was not able to do it until today (planned today or tomorrow). 5 files attached, 4 related to style, 1 to TYP (foskan.txt). Only those 4 style files have changes, compared to the standard.
The complete set of files is ./mkgmap-rNNNN/examples/styles/default/
There is nothing fancy nor complex, nor have i played around with the levels yet.
For reference i also added my TYP-file, which may help in case you find some type codes which are non standard (there might be a few). The type file is shared and does contain a few things that are not used by the minimal style (don't get confused).
Summery of the style, which is based on the default mkgmap example. All changes comments are marked with ## to be able to tell them apart from regular comments given after #.
polygons and points do have a lot of disabled information. Buildings, shops, and most of the parking types are disables.
lines doesn't have as many changes and probably a few more small waterways (streams, rapids, waterfalls) can be disabled to remove yet a bit of data.
note for polygons. Waters and forests are still visible, since it adds information to the map, but if natural objects are not important for you, there is more space to save.
i have made one change in lines file to display the road name on tertiary roads instead of the reference. this does make sense in nordic countries, where tertiary roads are usually only referred to with the name.
Ski lifts (arealways in general) are set in similar way as railroads.
One last thing to mention is that i have updated the inc/address file. Close to the end there is a section in which the mkgmap:phone is updated to show information about which fuels are sold at fuel stations. This is not fully complete for all fuel types but the ones i somehow considered important. Depending on where one is, a few more fuel types can easily be added.
A note. The mkgmap:phone seems to be 50 characters maximum, longer data will be truncated and not shown on the device it seems.
Regards and happy new year! Karl
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 10:16:51 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi Karl,
don't you want to share your minimal style? :)
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.27. 20:59, 7770 wrote:
Hi. A few observations about the TopoActive europe map. (i have it on a GPSMAP 66st).
The map is rendered slower than most custom made maps. Updates occur 2 times per year, but even at those times many changes to OSM are not present. Perhaps they only update some parts yearly. Points lack all kind of additional information which other mappers add (opening hours, region, phone numbers, etc.). One nice thing is colour marked national parks and reserves. Being an outdoor map, it lacks some information about shelters in the wilderness. Routing is possible only for outdoor activities (cycle, walk, hike, direct), automotive routing (car, motorcycle) is disabled.
I have tried creating a minimal style. This lowers the data to about 75 % or my normal set up. But i did not change the level, which i will try :-) Currently I am no way near the compression which TopoActive achieves. Using input data which is about 6,7 GB in pbf format, creates a gmapsupp just below 4 GB for normal and around 3 GB for minimal style. These numbers feels similar to getting France into 1.9 GB from 3.7 GB pbf (geofabrik).
The minimal set up is not very fancy at all, it disables things not wanted. Buildings, shops, most of parkings, and a bit more.
Today i cannot send off any style, but in case that would be of interest let me know and i can share it in a few days (guessing Wednesday or Thursday).
Regards Karl
On söndag 27 december 2020 kl. 20:08:10 CET Gerd Petermann wrote:
Hi Pierre,
my first guess would be that the level 0 is at resolution 23 instead of
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 13:27:06 CET Vuki wrote: 24.
Gerd
________________________________________ Von: mkgmap-dev <mkgmap-dev-bounces@lists.mkgmap.org.uk> im Auftrag von Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Dezember
2020
19:37 An: Development list for mkgmap Betreff: [mkgmap-dev] Garmin Topo Europe map
Hello guys,
I've just discovered the Garmin TopoActive Europe map based on OpenStreetMap data. This map is sold at a price of 50€ or is pre-installed on some new devices. I've just seen it on the device of one of my friends and it looks very good. I'm surprised to see that for West Europe, it takes only 2.8GB and is quite complete (index for search, routable, ...).
For now, I generate my own maps based on your excellent tool but the result is much bigger (1.9GB only for France with probably more details). So, my question is: does anybody have a similar configuration (style files and command line) to obtain a result like the Garmin TopoActive Europe ?
Thanks, Pierre _______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
Eastern and Northern Europe are pretty big... I would say for a map that is all of Europe - or at least full EU plus UK - covering all roads and highway=track without NT format it will not work. And you would like at least some polygons too - lakes, forest, urban area. And big rivers and some more things. Going to resolution 23,21,19,17 vs 24,22,20,17 is definitely worth it if its about the 4GB limit IMHO. also 23 resolution maps will be faster than 24 resolution maps on the device. But more important is of course that you reduce detail when it comes to map speed. If it's about car navigation, I feel 23 is alright. When it comes to foot/bicycle and so on - 24 is a must IMHO. However - who is still using garmin devices for car navigation? then especially with OSM which in my eyes misses too much for car navigation while it's advantages don't play out at all when it comes to maps reduced for car routing. Hard nowadays to compete with google maps. On Mon, 4 Jan 2021 at 04:47, DD8KQ <dd8kq@gmx.de> wrote:
I do not think that Europe Map within 4 GB is out of question. I've managed to build a map with lets say Central Europe, which is in the range of about 3.3 Gb. See attached jpg for size and detail of the map.
Hopefully the attachments will go into the list.
Regards Am 03.01.2021 um 18:35 schrieb Felix Hartmann:
Garmin city navigator maps use 23. Else a Europe map within 4GB is out of question. However they use NT format too, which is about 1/3 smaller additionally.
Same I guess for their Topo Europe maps.
On Mon, 4 Jan 2021, 01:03 Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Karl,
Thanks for your analysis, very instructive. I've tried several of your steps and arrived at the conclusion that it's not a good idea to set the resolution to 23. Here are the 2 main reasons: 1. as you mentioned the map becomes less accurate, some roundabouts are converted into triangles, some line segments are misaligned ... 2. from the cgpsmapper guide: "IMG file should be created with Level 0 equal to 24 – otherwise distance calculation might be wrong"
Do you know if the Garmin TopoActive map uses resolution 23 or 24 ?
Pierre
On Sun, Jan 3, 2021 at 8:21 AM 7770 <7770@foskan.eu> wrote:
Hi. I made a few tests to lower the size of the maps.
Comparison is made to my standard map which is based on the styles example in mkgmap but extended a bit for my purposes. This has 100 % size. There are 4 levels, 24 is the most detailed resolution.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 78 %.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 64 %.
Using my minimal style (discussed earlier in this thread). Compared to normal map, it is about 75 % in size.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 63 %.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 51 %.
I noted that when resolution is set to 23 polygons smaller than the mentioned raster at ~4.8 m disappear. They also do get distorted. Buildings are such polygons that are effected a lot, and it is (in my opinion) a good idea to disable buildings and similar polygons entirely when lowering the resolution. Coast lines and alike become less detailed of course. Some line segments have become a bit misaligned (i noted bus stop platforms and similar short lines can have this issue).
I yet have to check how well these maps work on a unit but it seems possible to lower the size quite a lot if it is desired.
Regards Karl
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 13:27:06 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi,
am also working on a "lite" style and there may be some nice idea in yours to use :) will check that out, thanks!
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.30. 12:08, 7770 wrote:
Hi. I am ok with sharing the style, but i was not able to do it until today (planned today or tomorrow). 5 files attached, 4 related to style, 1 to TYP (foskan.txt). Only those 4 style files have changes, compared to the standard.
The complete set of files is ./mkgmap-rNNNN/examples/styles/default/
There is nothing fancy nor complex, nor have i played around with the levels yet.
For reference i also added my TYP-file, which may help in case you find some type codes which are non standard (there might be a few). The type file is shared and does contain a few things that are not used by the minimal style (don't get confused).
Summery of the style, which is based on the default mkgmap example. All changes comments are marked with ## to be able to tell them apart from regular comments given after #.
polygons and points do have a lot of disabled information. Buildings, shops, and most of the parking types are disables.
lines doesn't have as many changes and probably a few more small waterways (streams, rapids, waterfalls) can be disabled to remove yet a bit of data.
note for polygons. Waters and forests are still visible, since it adds information to the map, but if natural objects are not important for you, there is more space to save.
i have made one change in lines file to display the road name on tertiary roads instead of the reference. this does make sense in nordic countries, where tertiary roads are usually only referred to with the name.
Ski lifts (arealways in general) are set in similar way as railroads.
One last thing to mention is that i have updated the inc/address file. Close to the end there is a section in which the mkgmap:phone is updated to show information about which fuels are sold at fuel stations. This is not fully complete for all fuel types but the ones i somehow considered important. Depending on where one is, a few more fuel types can easily be added.
A note. The mkgmap:phone seems to be 50 characters maximum, longer data will be truncated and not shown on the device it seems.
Regards and happy new year! Karl
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 10:16:51 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi Karl,
don't you want to share your minimal style? :)
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.27. 20:59, 7770 wrote:
Hi. A few observations about the TopoActive europe map. (i have it on a GPSMAP 66st).
The map is rendered slower than most custom made maps. Updates occur 2 times per year, but even at those times many changes to OSM are not present. Perhaps they only update some parts yearly. Points lack all kind of additional information which other mappers add (opening hours, region, phone numbers, etc.). One nice thing is colour marked national parks and reserves. Being an outdoor map, it lacks some information about shelters in the wilderness. Routing is possible only for outdoor activities (cycle, walk, hike, direct), automotive routing (car, motorcycle) is disabled.
I have tried creating a minimal style. This lowers the data to about 75 % or my normal set up. But i did not change the level, which i will try :-) Currently I am no way near the compression which TopoActive achieves. Using input data which is about 6,7 GB in pbf format, creates a gmapsupp just below 4 GB for normal and around 3 GB for minimal style. These numbers feels similar to getting France into 1.9 GB from 3.7 GB pbf (geofabrik).
The minimal set up is not very fancy at all, it disables things not wanted. Buildings, shops, most of parkings, and a bit more.
Today i cannot send off any style, but in case that would be of interest let me know and i can share it in a few days (guessing Wednesday or Thursday).
Regards Karl
On söndag 27 december 2020 kl. 20:08:10 CET Gerd Petermann wrote:
Hi Pierre,
my first guess would be that the level 0 is at resolution 23 instead of 24.
Gerd
________________________________________ Von: mkgmap-dev <mkgmap-dev-bounces@lists.mkgmap.org.uk> im Auftrag von Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Dezember 2020 19:37 An: Development list for mkgmap Betreff: [mkgmap-dev] Garmin Topo Europe map
Hello guys,
I've just discovered the Garmin TopoActive Europe map based on OpenStreetMap data. This map is sold at a price of 50€ or is pre-installed on some new devices. I've just seen it on the device of one of my friends and it looks very good. I'm surprised to see that for West Europe, it takes only 2.8GB and is quite complete (index for search, routable, ...).
For now, I generate my own maps based on your excellent tool but the result is much bigger (1.9GB only for France with probably more details). So, my question is: does anybody have a similar configuration (style files and command line) to obtain a result like the Garmin TopoActive Europe ?
Thanks, Pierre _______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
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-- Felix Hartman - Openmtbmap.org & VeloMap.org
Hi. just in case anyone is interested, i noticed that the Garmin Topo Europe map maps place=isolated_dwelling, whereas the example styles in mkgmap does not. I haven't noticed similar situation for place=farm, place=locality. But they may be handled in the same way. Something like this can be added into the points style file to have the data in the map. # resolution 24 or 23 place=isolated_dwelling & name=* [0x0b00 resolution 24] Regards Karl On måndag 4 januari 2021 kl. 07:01:18 CET Felix Hartmann wrote:
Eastern and Northern Europe are pretty big... I would say for a map that is all of Europe - or at least full EU plus UK - covering all roads and highway=track without NT format it will not work. And you would like at least some polygons too - lakes, forest, urban area. And big rivers and some more things. Going to resolution 23,21,19,17 vs 24,22,20,17 is definitely worth it if its about the 4GB limit IMHO. also 23 resolution maps will be faster than 24 resolution maps on the device. But more important is of course that you reduce detail when it comes to map speed.
If it's about car navigation, I feel 23 is alright. When it comes to foot/bicycle and so on - 24 is a must IMHO. However - who is still using garmin devices for car navigation? then especially with OSM which in my eyes misses too much for car navigation while it's advantages don't play out at all when it comes to maps reduced for car routing. Hard nowadays to compete with google maps.
On Mon, 4 Jan 2021 at 04:47, DD8KQ <dd8kq@gmx.de> wrote:
I do not think that Europe Map within 4 GB is out of question. I've managed to build a map with lets say Central Europe, which is in the range of about 3.3 Gb. See attached jpg for size and detail of the map.
Hopefully the attachments will go into the list.
Regards Am 03.01.2021 um 18:35 schrieb Felix Hartmann:
Garmin city navigator maps use 23. Else a Europe map within 4GB is out of question. However they use NT format too, which is about 1/3 smaller additionally.
Same I guess for their Topo Europe maps.
On Mon, 4 Jan 2021, 01:03 Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Karl,
Thanks for your analysis, very instructive. I've tried several of your steps and arrived at the conclusion that it's not a good idea to set the resolution to 23. Here are the 2 main reasons: 1. as you mentioned the map becomes less accurate, some roundabouts are converted into triangles, some line segments are misaligned ... 2. from the cgpsmapper guide: "IMG file should be created with Level 0 equal to 24 – otherwise distance calculation might be wrong"
Do you know if the Garmin TopoActive map uses resolution 23 or 24 ?
Pierre
On Sun, Jan 3, 2021 at 8:21 AM 7770 <7770@foskan.eu> wrote:
Hi. I made a few tests to lower the size of the maps.
Comparison is made to my standard map which is based on the styles example in mkgmap but extended a bit for my purposes. This has 100 % size. There are 4 levels, 24 is the most detailed resolution.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 78 %.
Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 64 %.
Using my minimal style (discussed earlier in this thread). Compared to normal map, it is about 75 % in size.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 4 levels (option file). Size 63 %.
Using minimal style and Setting the resolution to 23 and changing relevant polygons, lines, points to show at 23 instead of 24. 3 levels (option file). levels = 0:23, 1:20, 2:18 Size 51 %.
I noted that when resolution is set to 23 polygons smaller than the mentioned raster at ~4.8 m disappear. They also do get distorted. Buildings are such polygons that are effected a lot, and it is (in my opinion) a good idea to disable buildings and similar polygons entirely when lowering the resolution. Coast lines and alike become less detailed of course. Some line segments have become a bit misaligned (i noted bus stop platforms and similar short lines can have this issue).
I yet have to check how well these maps work on a unit but it seems possible to lower the size quite a lot if it is desired.
Regards Karl
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 13:27:06 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi,
am also working on a "lite" style and there may be some nice idea in
yours
to use :) will check that out, thanks!
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.30. 12:08, 7770 wrote:
Hi. I am ok with sharing the style, but i was not able to do it until today (planned today or tomorrow). 5 files attached, 4 related to style, 1 to TYP (foskan.txt). Only those 4 style files have changes, compared to the standard.
The complete set of files is ./mkgmap-rNNNN/examples/styles/default/
There is nothing fancy nor complex, nor have i played around with the
levels
yet.
For reference i also added my TYP-file, which may help in case you
find some
type codes which are non standard (there might be a few). The type
file is
shared and does contain a few things that are not used by the minimal
style
(don't get confused).
Summery of the style, which is based on the default mkgmap example. All changes comments are marked with ## to be able to tell them apart
from
regular comments given after #.
polygons and points do have a lot of disabled information. Buildings, shops, and most of the parking types are disables.
lines doesn't have as many changes and probably a few more small
waterways
(streams, rapids, waterfalls) can be disabled to remove yet a bit of
data.
note for polygons. Waters and forests are still visible, since it adds information to the
map,
but if natural objects are not important for you, there is more space
to
save.
i have made one change in lines file to display the road name on
tertiary
roads instead of the reference. this does make sense in nordic
countries,
where tertiary roads are usually only referred to with the name.
Ski lifts (arealways in general) are set in similar way as railroads.
One last thing to mention is that i have updated the inc/address file. Close to the end there is a section in which the mkgmap:phone is
updated to
show information about which fuels are sold at fuel stations. This is
not
fully complete for all fuel types but the ones i somehow considered important. Depending on where one is, a few more fuel types can easily
be
added.
A note. The mkgmap:phone seems to be 50 characters maximum, longer data will be truncated and not shown on the device it seems.
Regards and happy new year! Karl
On onsdag 30 december 2020 kl. 10:16:51 CET Vuki wrote:
Hi Karl,
don't you want to share your minimal style? :)
Köszi: Vuki On 2020.12.27. 20:59, 7770 wrote:
Hi. A few observations about the TopoActive europe map. (i have it on a
GPSMAP
66st).
The map is rendered slower than most custom made maps. Updates occur 2 times per year, but even at those times many changes
to OSM
are not present. Perhaps they only update some parts yearly. Points lack all kind of additional information which other mappers add (opening hours, region, phone numbers, etc.). One nice thing is colour marked national parks and reserves. Being an outdoor map, it lacks some information about shelters in the wilderness. Routing is possible only for outdoor activities (cycle, walk, hike,
direct),
automotive routing (car, motorcycle) is disabled.
I have tried creating a minimal style. This lowers the data to about
75 % or
my normal set up. But i did not change the level, which i will try :-) Currently I am no way near the compression which TopoActive achieves.
Using
input data which is about 6,7 GB in pbf format, creates a gmapsupp just below 4 GB for normal and around 3 GB for minimal style. These numbers feels similar to getting France into 1.9 GB from 3.7 GB pbf
(geofabrik).
The minimal set up is not very fancy at all, it disables things not
wanted.
Buildings, shops, most of parkings, and a bit more.
Today i cannot send off any style, but in case that would be of
interest let
me know and i can share it in a few days (guessing Wednesday or
Thursday).
Regards Karl
On söndag 27 december 2020 kl. 20:08:10 CET Gerd Petermann wrote:
Hi Pierre,
my first guess would be that the level 0 is at resolution 23 instead
of 24.
Gerd
________________________________________ Von: mkgmap-dev <mkgmap-dev-bounces@lists.mkgmap.org.uk> im Auftrag
von
Pierre Brico <pierre.brico@gmail.com> Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Dezember
2020
19:37 An: Development list for mkgmap Betreff: [mkgmap-dev] Garmin Topo Europe map
Hello guys,
I've just discovered the Garmin TopoActive Europe map based on
OpenStreetMap
data. This map is sold at a price of 50€ or is pre-installed on some
new
devices. I've just seen it on the device of one of my friends and it
looks
very good. I'm surprised to see that for West Europe, it takes only
2.8GB
and is quite complete (index for search, routable, ...).
For now, I generate my own maps based on your excellent tool but the
result
is much bigger (1.9GB only for France with probably more details). So,
my
question is: does anybody have a similar configuration (style files and command line) to obtain a result like the Garmin TopoActive Europe ?
Thanks, Pierre _______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing list mkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.uk http://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/mkgmap-dev
_______________________________________________ mkgmap-dev mailing listmkgmap-dev@lists.mkgmap.org.ukhttp://www.mkgmap.org.uk/mailman/listin fo/mkgmap-dev> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
##################################################### Manfred Haiduk, Zum Fischbach 9, 52393 Hürtgenwald e-mail mhaiduk@t-online.de #####################################################
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participants (4)
-
7770 -
DD8KQ -
Felix Hartmann -
Pierre Brico